If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

Best British Locomotive

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Hermod, May 12, 2017.

  1. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    7,679
    Likes Received:
    1,748
    Occupation:
    Gentleman of leisure, nowadays
    Location:
    Near Leeds
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    The limitation on sustained output on all our steam locos is the fireman. It doesn't matter how big the cylinders or how big the boiler. Even with two people firing, as often happens nowadays, there's a practical limit to how much you can shovel through the firehole door. At 2 ton/hr and an overall efficiency of say 7% that's going to come out at about 1600hp. Pushing that to 3 ton/hr will give 2400hp but that tenderful of coal will soon need replenishing
    And the not inconsiderable power required to drag the locomotive itself up any sort of gradient. For 140 ton loco on a 1 in 100 gradient at 75 mph, that's 626 hp according to my slide rule. Diesel or steam.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
  2. Hermod

    Hermod New Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2017
    Messages:
    67
    Likes Received:
    9
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Klitmoeller,Denmark
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    The tester diesel must be ballasted to Tornado mass.
    If Tornado boiler and,blastpipe is like V2 ,2.5 tons coal per hr is max rate that can evaporate water, and gives 1990 indicated horsepower.
    The LMS is 2.7 tons and 2550 ihp.
    One hour/one fireman indicated horsepower is 1615 on LNER and 1480 on LMS
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
  3. Allegheny

    Allegheny New Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2015
    Messages:
    121
    Likes Received:
    43
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    For a Diesel-electric locomotive the efficiency of the transmission will not be greater than about 85%, maybe less.
     
  4. Hermod

    Hermod New Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2017
    Messages:
    67
    Likes Received:
    9
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Klitmoeller,Denmark
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    All this diesel Tornado ton talk from me is because I have a Question:
    Can a more or less max power british steam locomotive pull a worthwhile load fast enough on mainlines without causing problems for other trains?
    It has been proved beyond doubt, that it can run a ton.
    But for how long and how loaded.
    A diesel of say 2000crankhorsepower ,that can run a ton,who got a pseudo tender so that mass and air resistance equalled the Tornado can simulate fast steam mainline excursions.
    If steam mainline becomes a nuissance I offer the advice(without being payed or asked for advice)that Settle Carisle can be a world beater for scenic steam railwaying.
    If this happens I have an idea for a better steam locomotive.
    Thank You for reading ,objecting and answering.
    That LMS pacific picture alone has made it worthwhile.
     
  5. Allegheny

    Allegheny New Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2015
    Messages:
    121
    Likes Received:
    43
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    If it is simply a question of power then you could double head, but there are all sorts of other mechanical stresses that need to be considered for high speed running.

    There was a discussion on this forum a while ago that some combinations of locomotives were not permitted to double head. I've had a look, but I can't find it.
     
  6. R.W. Grant

    R.W. Grant New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    58
    Likes Received:
    48
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired machinist
    Location:
    north central Pennsylvania usa
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    At least to me, for as great as they are, the Black Five locos are not world beaters but when Riley's 5's are doubleheaded they are certainly something to behold! They seem to define power.
     
  7. Copper-capped

    Copper-capped New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2017
    Messages:
    183
    Likes Received:
    131
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stanthorpe, QLD, Australia
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    For favourite passenger loco I would choose GWR Saint. For freight, also GWR, 72xx 2-8-2t...such a beast! There was also an excellent shout earlier for City of Truro with Indian red frames. Nice.

    If I had to go out of my comfort zone so to speak, there are any number of southern tank engines that tickle my fancy in a weird sort of way. I would be hard pressed to narrow it down to a single class. :)
     
  8. mickpop

    mickpop Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2010
    Messages:
    3,974
    Likes Received:
    2,108
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Cheshire
    It is not always necessary to be big to be beautiful. I rather like these attractive little Bagnall built narrow gauge 'W' Class 0-6-2s built for Indian Railways

    wbilimora2.jpg
     
    andrewshimmin likes this.
  9. Chris86

    Chris86 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2011
    Messages:
    510
    Likes Received:
    115
    Occupation:
    Outdoor Pursuits and Technical rescue
    Location:
    Wherever the work is.
    Prettiest- 780 'Alice' ......


    Chris
     
  10. andykeithharris

    andykeithharris New Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2012
    Messages:
    23
    Likes Received:
    5
    To me the best British loco, certainly as an all rounder was the 9F, which could handle just about anything that is thrown at it and with nicely balanced looks.

    Given that looks are in the eye of the beholder I also quite like the Ivatt/Standard 4 Moguls

    Andy
     
  11. 30567

    30567 Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2012
    Messages:
    1,072
    Likes Received:
    387
    I spent a couple of hours looking at the difference between a schedule with a max of 75 and one with a max of 90, together with Tornado's water economy. Given the way fast trains are flighted on the East Coast Main Line the difference is appreciable. With a max of 90 and a single stop at Grantham , London-York in under four hours becomes possible. For the foreign tourist market this then becomes an attraction in the 'iconic day out' category. I think that's the market Mr Bunker is after.
     
  12. The Black Hat

    The Black Hat Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2010
    Messages:
    589
    Likes Received:
    132
    Occupation:
    Defender of the Faith
    Location:
    51F

Share This Page